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Merlin
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The Wizard

Re: Bouts-rimes
Reply #8 - Jan 1st, 1970 at 12:00am
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Good sport, Daniel.

As to "volleys", that was our own name for doing what we were doing, not knowing that there already was a name for it.   

The 3 of us are 2 ladies, Sue & Fran.  Our styles are very complimentary, and it seems we volley well.  Also, we made it into an anthology by Dr McAllister, which is rated quiet highly.  He contributed copies to a large number of universities, so our feathers rival a peacock's.

Unfortunately, it's been a longer time back, and even while I checked archives, I can't locate threads.  We had been on ezboard, 1st at Flowing Quills, then at the Maelstrom.  However, I believe we did more at FQ.   

A short summary of what we did - first in sonnets, then in Spenserian Stanzas.  One would post, usually with a character theme, ie - people and games they play.  Fran was usually first.  My reply came back with the male perspective, giving the same situation from a man's pov.  Sue quite often brought a third party view, and the whole made for some great reading.  I'll dig up something as an example.

Right now we're doing the bouts which maintain the end-words.  The various differing scenarios are really interesting to watch as they develop.  Do you still read at MM?

Thanks for being interested.

Merlin
  
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Just_Daniel
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'volley' ?
Reply #7 - Jan 1st, 1970 at 12:00am
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Merlin wrote on Jan 1st, 1970 at 12:00am:
Actually, what we called "volleys" are the same thing, and there were 3 of us who did a fair number of those for the fun of it.
Go ahead and give one a bout!

Now you have my head in a whirl, Eric!  I've never heard of a poetic 'volley'... so could you give me a link to that concept somewhere.  I can't find the expression so far.

And who are the 'few of us'... and where ?  Grin  What did you do?

I'm game... throw somethin' at me (besides tomatoes or a piet or the like)!

sLightly anxious, Daniel  8)
  
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Merlin
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The Wizard

Re: Bouts-rimes
Reply #6 - Jan 1st, 1970 at 12:00am
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Thanks again, Ren.   
I believe we are actually on the same wavelength, pretty well.  The list gave me cause to wonder, and the challenge brought out interesting retorts.  Quite right, meter variation could have changed things, and in one of those others I mention, I do put a few bounces in.  btw, I agree that only a few will catch the hidden meaning, but them's extended metaphors for ya.

I'm pleased you took the time to read.


Thank you Daniel.
Interesting article, info I wasn't aware of in total.  I ran across the bouts while compiling my text for the manual I'm getting together.  Actually, what we called "volleys" are the same thing, and there were 3 of us who did a fair number of those for the fun of it.
Go ahead and give one a bout!


Thank you for stopping in, Dande.   
I'm not lion when I say that the funning is one of the best parts of all this.  Oh, I don't mind learning a thing or more, but all in all, I do it for the pleasure.  If I can bring a chuckle, even better.

Merlin
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dandelionsndaffodi
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Re: Bouts-rimes
Reply #5 - Jan 1st, 1970 at 12:00am
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Hey!!  Makes per-fect sense to meeeeee.
'course I'm still stuck on all that kissing
causing a riot!!!   I love it!!  and love what
you did with the challenge.   Keep on funning!!
  
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Just_Daniel
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Bouts-Rimés...
Reply #4 - Jan 1st, 1970 at 12:00am
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I'd never heard of this exercise, Eric, so thank you very much.  Sounds like a wonderful challenge... and it's no surprise to me that you've done so well at it.  Here is an interesting article about Bouts-Rimés [Fr = 'rhymed-ends' ] in Wikepedia.

You already have some interesting suggestions; I'll wait to see what you might do with them.

deLighting in your enLightening us, Daniel  8)

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duetsdove
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Re: Bouts-rimes
Reply #3 - Jan 1st, 1970 at 12:00am
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Thank you for your thoughts, Ren. 
 
Your coupla cents are accepted.  Good call on the 2 news, I actually missed that and will fix. 
 
Regarding the extra syllable, that’s what the given words dictate.  I was amused when I read the assignment, that they would actually give feminine endings and suggest a sonnet.  However, it is generally accepted that iambic pentameter holds even with feminine endings – they don’t really count.  Unless one is yelling at the kids to be kwi-ET, it’s pretty hard to make an iamb out of that. 
 
Exactly. . .the words that you were dealt making the extra syllable almost a given. . .unless you were to break the iambic pattern. . .and, of course, neither of the two are verboten. . .either using that extra syllable which is really quite allowable. . .or. . .breaking the iambic pattern on occasion. . .which can be done to quite good effect.  However, for the purpose of crit on the work. . .that extra syllable bears mention.
 
You’re not buying the 2 lines following the sestet?  Pity.  You lose the best part.  I’ll suggest a re-read of those first 6 lines, then think in extended metaphorical fashion – young lovers smooching wildly under the town clock, what happens?  Consider an alternate meaning for “die Pflaume.”  Tis true, the literal meaning is not that great. 
 
Peas. . .are close. . .two peas in a pod. . .and the leprechaun has a bucket full. . .no prunes. . .the dried equivalent of die Pflaume, of course. . .I'm still not convinced that this is the best part.  lolol  And it may be that a portion of the general readership will miss any hidden meanings that relate back to the smoochy couple. . .which is why I mention it. . .and still don't quite buy it. . .I don't hate it. . .because it lends a "light" air to the work that brings a smirk. . .it just still feels out of place. . .which is simply my perception. . .I'd be looking for a fairie, of course, and not a leprechaun.  *smile*
 
For the river bar, I meant a gravel bar.  The pistol line will make more sense when you establish the Leprechaun line. 
 
I can see a sexual reference in the pistol line. . .again. . .for me. . .it just seems a tad out of place.  But them's the words you was given. . .
 
I’ve done 2 more with this word set.  In those, I’ve actually used “sweat pea”, and prune as a verb.  For that reason, I’ll not change here. 
 
It can sometimes be difficult to create poetry from those word lists. . .though I love the challenge of them. . .absolutely.  Which is why I find our TOR challenge on the train so much fun. . .especially reading how different people work the phrases into their poetry. 
 
Your comments are greatly appreciated.   
 
I was happy to have read and commented.
 
Merlin 
 
 
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Merlin
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The Wizard

Re: Bouts-rimes
Reply #2 - Jan 1st, 1970 at 12:00am
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Thank you for your thoughts, Ren.

Your coupla cents are accepted.  Good call on the 2 news, I actually missed that and will fix.

Regarding the extra syllable, that’s what the given words dictate.  I was amused when I read the assignment, that they would actually give feminine endings and suggest a sonnet.  However, it is generally accepted that iambic pentameter holds even with feminine endings – they don’t really count.  Unless one is yelling at the kids to be kwi-ET, it’s pretty hard to make an iamb out of that.

You’re not buying the 2 lines following the sestet?  Pity.  You lose the best part.  I’ll suggest a re-read of those first 6 lines, then think in extended metaphorical fashion – young lovers smooching wildly under the town clock, what happens?  Consider an alternate meaning for “die Pflaume.”  Tis true, the literal meaning is not that great.

For the river bar, I meant a gravel bar.  The pistol line will make more sense when you establish the Leprechaun line.

I’ve done 2 more with this word set.  In those, I’ve actually used “sweat pea”, and prune as a verb.  For that reason, I’ll not change here.

Your comments are greatly appreciated.  

Merlin



 


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duetsdove
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Re: Bouts-rimes
Reply #1 - Jan 1st, 1970 at 12:00am
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It's always certainly interesting the group of words that can get put together for an exercise such as this. . .

The old town clock struck twelve, then all was quiet;   
we paused beneath it for another kiss   
but one became a dozen, then a riot   
that sent me spinning through a deep abyss   
where amaranth and lotus blossom trees   
presented colors in each shade of June. 
A Leprechaun, his bucket full of peas,   
stood up and smiled, still searching for a prune. 

I enjoy the opening. . .in L6. . .I might suggest

presented colors in the shades of June.

The last two lines. . .not buying them. . .even in conjunction with the "magickal" nature of the work.  I might use prune as to prune an object instead of the fruit which just seems out of place. . .as does peas. . .though you could use the flower sweet pea(s) and that would be a more likely fit for what the opening says. . .and you could still use a leprechaun if you wish.

 
This star-filled night, a-glitter like a crystal,   
will end too soon, swept down a river bar 
and in its wake, spent shells, a useless pistol 
and lonely love chords strummed on my guitar. 

There are several lines throughout where you have added an extra syllable. . .and while not "verboten" I'm thinking you could clear those out in most of the lines.  However, keeping the iambic could possibly be difficult I would suppose.  Swept down a river bar. . .you mean like a sand bar in the middle of the river. . .perhaps

will end too soon, swept over river's bar

and the pistol line. . .is like a sore thumb. . .no suggestions. . .maybe a duel or something. . .I do like the last line.

 
Before new dawn awoke, while songbirds brooded,   
new feelings lingered though the night concluded. 

I'd replace one of new with another word. . .

just a coupla cents

~Ren~

 
  
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Merlin
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The Wizard

Bouts-rimes
Jan 1st, 1970 at 12:00am
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A book I currently have my nose in has an exercise after each chapter.  The one I’m on assigns a “bouts-rimes”, giving end words and having the student write a poem using those words in the order given.  They leave the form completely open but do make reference to an English sonnet, which I chose to follow.   
The 14 words are in this order: quiet, kiss, riot, abyss, trees, June, peas, prune, crystal, bar, pistol, guitar, brooded, concluded.
For lack of a better title, I used the page number for now, Page 213.  That has now been fixed.




Amaranth and Lotus

The old town clock struck twelve, then all was quiet; 
we paused beneath it for another kiss 
but one became a dozen, then a riot 
that sent me spinning through a deep abyss 
where amaranth and lotus blossom trees 
presented colors in each shade of June.
A Leprechaun, his bucket full of peas, 
stood up and smiled, still searching for a prune.

This star-filled night, a-glitter like a crystal, 
will end too soon, swept down a river bar
and in its wake, spent shells, a useless pistol
and lonely love chords strummed on your guitar.

Before new dawn awoke, as songbirds brooded, 
fresh feelings tingled while this night concluded.


Original L14 - 
new feelings lingered though the night concluded.



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